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Light frost last night

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phoenixtropicals
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Joined: 06 May 2008
Posts: 1207
Location: Mesa Arizona

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 7:44 pm    Post subject: Light frost last night Reply with quote

I just had a light frost here and the temperature only went down to 35°F.

Plumeria leaves but not stems took some damage from the frost. I expect the plumerias to lose their leaves during winter anyways so no problem.

The older leaves on the papaya were hammered but the new ones were untouched. I found this odd because I'd usually expect newer growth to be more tender but maybe the older leaves developed during warmer conditions?

All my other plants did well. How did other peoples yards do?
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MKIVRYAN



Joined: 07 Dec 2010
Posts: 154
Location: Phoenix/Scottsdale

PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I covered everything small and the larger stuff got propane heaters. Zero damage for now Smile
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myamberdog



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 323
Location: palm springs, california

PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, PT - I've noticed in the past that the bigger papaya leaves get hammered before the smaller newer growth when it gets frosty.

It was about 34 on New Year's eve night at my house and i had covered everything the previous night.

I've been covering up anytime I hear say 37 degrees or less predicted. I'm just paranoid this winter season - don't know why. In fact I leave the frost cloth on for 2 or 3 days at a time when the cold fronts linger a bit - too much work to take it all off and on all the time....

Last night we finally only got down to 40 degrees so I pulled everything off today and it appears we'll be safe for this whole next week at least....
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Amadioranch



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So jealous of you guys in the "heat island". Out here on the edge of town in Laveen I have been seeing night time lows in the 20's for the past 7 days. Monday night was the worst at 23 degrees and more than 9 hours below 32. Keeping tropicals out here takes serious commitment.
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myamberdog



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 323
Location: palm springs, california

PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Amadio - yeah I do feel for you in your "tropicals' quest. The one
good thing about your lows is you kind of expect them, where with us
we can get caught off guard with that magic 32 degree mark as only a possibility......

I do hear Jan. is supposed to be drier than normal - whatever
that might mean....


mDog
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myamberdog



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 323
Location: palm springs, california

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

...while the rest of Palm Springs last night only got down to like 37 (actually that's probably the airport reading about 3 miles away), my backyard recorded ad 30.9 temperature and just to confirm that reading, my neighbors's house had a pipe burst on the roof.

I'm quite sure now I live in a "cold sink" which I think means as the as the sun goes down, the warmish air rises displaced by the cold air comning down from the mountain probably less that 2 miles away and drains out thru my neighborhood and out into the Coachella valley
at night....

Discouraging as I seem to have to cover plants more than others in my area I'm guessing...but who would have checked this out before buying a house even BEFORE an interest in growing tropicals had taken hold!





myamberdawg
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Amadioranch



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes we count on nearly every night in Jan and Feb being below freezing, and for the most part thats true. Usually along with half of December and most of March. And yes, there are some advantages to just counting on that its going to happen. We always put up our frost protection before Thanksgiving and it stays up till April. With enough planning it can be done pretty reliably, even in this cold.
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Amadioranch



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The blue line on the graph is the outside air temperature over the last 7 days. The yellow is the temp inside the frost structure. The green is humidity. This monitoring system has been excellent.


temp 1-5.jpg
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Light frost last night


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myamberdog



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 323
Location: palm springs, california

PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that's very cool Amadio - what kind of monitoring system
do you have...and is it wireless????


thanks...MDog
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Amadioranch



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is what I have. http://www.lacrossetechnology.com/alerts/
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phoenixtropicals
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Joined: 06 May 2008
Posts: 1207
Location: Mesa Arizona

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting posts. Nice graph! Looks like we might be in for a nasty weekend. Let's cross our fingers and hope the cold front turns away from us. My smaller papaya leaves got zapped by the second cold spell, by the way. I actually posted that comment right after the second cold spell and the smaller ones looked like they survived two cold spells, however, they shriveled the next day. Definitely they survived they first cold spell while the larger ones didn't. Interesting how the newer/smaller leaves are slightly more hardy. Papayas really are so darn frost sensitive.

Stem is currently not damaged but this weekend might be the end of it. Maybe I'll try burying it in mulch or something. Its only about 3 ft. tall currently.
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myamberdog



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 323
Location: palm springs, california

PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PT - you are covering your papayas, though, yes?

I've taken the trouble this year of coverig ALL my papayas,
big and small, and so far they are a bit frost battered on the
edges but no worse for wear....yeah, we're getting that major
cold fron here too in Palm Springs with like 4 nights at least
predicted in the mid to upper 30's starting on Thursday night.
Funny thing is, it was 80 today....

A cold winter so far, at least since early December....

Good luck everyone...

myamberdog
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phoenixtropicals
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Joined: 06 May 2008
Posts: 1207
Location: Mesa Arizona

PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No didn't cover this last time. I was out of town and just covered my most valued stuff. Papayas are not at the very top of my list and also they seem to get beaten by just being covered if it gets windy. The frost cloth flaps against the leaves. I am going to try burying the stem in a mulch pile this next freeze and see how that goes. You are lucky. Mid thirties would be fine with me, but we are predicted to be in the mid or lower 30's in downtown Phoenix which means we'll be in the upper 20's here. That can really hammer things. Argghhh.
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phoenixtropicals
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Joined: 06 May 2008
Posts: 1207
Location: Mesa Arizona

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:03 pm    Post subject: Hard core freeze protection Reply with quote

I'm going hard core with the frost protection this time. I went out and bought a bunch of 10x20 foot plastic painters drop cloth. 1 mil thickness I think. I duct tape 2 together to make a 20x20 which is big enough to cover a small tree. Frost cloth is good but still lets a lot of cold air through. When things get really cold I think maybe plastic is a must. However, you can't leave plastic on for a long time like frost cloth, but since I am home that isn't a problem. We'll see how it goes. I am also burying my smallest plants in mulch. I am using 75 watt incandescent bulbs in a lot of my enclosures too.

Painters cloth is also nice a cheap. $4 per sheet.
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Amadioranch



Joined: 07 Jan 2012
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ive done alot of covering things in plastic like you are planning and while it can help keep in mind that plastic has next to no insulation value. My 40 ft hoop house covered in 4 mil greenhouse film is only good for a +1 degree rise over ambient without additional heat. I have to burn alot of propane in there some nights. If its a small enough structure I use alot of heavy blankets on top to keep the heat from just rising out. Anything to provide a little extra insulation so that my heat source isnt in vain.

You might very well have to use more heat than a 75 watt bulb can provide. I monitor and log all this stuff because we are below freezing for at least 80 nights a winter....
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